JAN. 3. 1832.] The Judiciary. [H. or R. ing; such a sense of honor as would shrink from commun- the army, than there would be vacancies for them; for it ing with treachery or desertion, and would urge the sol- would require annually only one out of about every dier to the patriot's last and dearest privilege--the sacri- eleven thousand of our population to fill up the army, fice of his life for his country's weal. Compare such an provided eleven hundred should be annually admitted. army, said he, with the one we now have, and let it be The whole army, with the exception, perhaps, of the known that it will cost the country much less money than lowest class, would be capable of enduring active service, the present peace establishment, and that it will be pro-and might be divided into divisions and battalions, and ductive of so much good, and he was sure but few, if any, stationed at the military posts throughout the Eastern, would be found who would hesitate in deciding in favor of Middle, Southern, and Western States, requiring a change the plan proposed. An army, said he, of six thousand of position every year, so that the senior division should men must be kept in service in time of peace; and he be always posted on the Western frontier to preserve would ask whether it would not be better to dismiss the peace among our citizens and the Indian tribes, ready at present soldiers from the army, since they are of no earth- any moment for the field, where any difficulty should ly service to the country, and substitute in their place such arise. This division, said he, of eleven hundred ablea class of young men as he had named, who, should they bodied, temperate, high-minded young men, of twenty ever be called into active service, would make a better years of age, (every one of whom would be fit for a army than that which Pyrrhus wished for, when he said, leader,) would be more efficient and powerful than the "with such an army I could conquer the world." The whole standing army as it now is, for, being young and full great desideratum, said he, in the present system of edu- of military ardor, they would be ready and willing at all cation in our colleges and academies in this country, is times to meet an enemy; honor would make them faithful, discipline. Our professors are men of science, our studies pride zealous, and hope persevering. are well selected and well arranged, and every facility is The resolution was then agreed to. extended that can be desired; and the only difficulty lies in the fact that students cannot be compelled to study. A military discipline introduced into a literary institution would obviate that difficulty; for in the army, where military science is to be acquired, the discipline would, of necessity, be adopted, and the result would be the best possible evidence of its worth. The instruction, said he, which the recruit would receive in military tactics, would require the very exercise which the soldier needs, and health and strength would be promoted for vigorous application to stu ly. The mind and body would be constantly and profitably employed, and no time left for the acquisition of those pernicious habits which now infest and enervate the army. THE JUDICIARY. Mr. PENDLETON, of New York, submitted for consideration the following resolutions: 1. Resolved, That it is expedient to bring in a bill to regulate and declare the appellate jurisdiction of the Supreme Court of the United States in criminal cases arising in the State courts. 2. Resolved, That, in the proposed bill, the provisions of the 25th section of the act To establish the judicial courts of the United States," passed September 24, 1789, shall be declared to apply the final judgments in criminal cases, which are now depending, or which shall hereafter arise, in the State courts. Besides, said Mr. W., if the plan should be adopted, there 3. Resolved, That, in the proposed bill, adequate proviwill be a vast saving to the Government; for the principal sions shall be inserted, to enforce the return of all process inducement for the soldier to enter the service would be to and proceedings in the court below to the Supreme Court obtain an education, and not for the pay he would receive. of the United States. The annual pay of the non-commissioned officers and pri- 4. Resolved, That, in the proposed bill, it will be expedivates, under the existing laws, is $368,664; the weekly ra- ent to provide that in all cases a writ of error, to be allowtion may be estimated at $20,000, and the expense of enlisted in pursuance of the act, shall have the effect to suspend ing the men, including contingent expenses, $35,000; add the execution of the judgment complained of, and that to this $100,000, for the loss the Government now annually adequate penalties shall be imposed upon any person or sustains by desertion, and the aggregate amount is $523,664. persons who shall, in this respect, violate the provisions of By reducing the pay of the non-commissioned officers and the act. soldiers to $2, as proposed in the resolution, (which will be sufficient to supply all the wants of the soldier,) and the pay of the army will then amount to $122,800 a year; add to Mr. BEARDSLEY, of New York, objecting to the this, for the salary of the professor and tutors, the sum phraseology of the resolutions, wished to amend them so as of $155,000, (which is a large estimate,) and the aggre- to limit them to an instruction to inquire into the subject. gate amount will be but $277,000, for it will require no The SPEAKER said that no amendment could now be more to subsist and clothe the army under the proposed made, because the pending question was on commitment plan, than it now costs the Government. Deduct that to a Committee of the Whole, for the purpose of being sum from the aggregate amount it now costs the Govern- there considered. These resolutions Mr. P. moved to refer to a Committee of the Whole on the state of the Union. ment, and there will be an annual saving of at least $245, Mr. CARSON, of North Carolina, objected to their goto say nothing of the inestimable benefits that would re-ing to a Committee of the Whole in their present shape. sult to the army in a moral and intellectual point of view. Mr. PENDLETON intimated that he had no design, in And sir, said he, there is no reason to fear that, by re- the motion which he had made, to ask the House at all to ducing the pay as proposed, there will be any difficulty commit itself at present upon the points embraced in his in raising the army, or in finding competent non-commis- proposition. sioned officers; for as they would be selected from among Mr. DAVIS, of Massachusetts, not willing to act hastily the most deserving of the soldiers, it would be esteemed in a matter of such importance as that now under considera high honor to hold the office. And let it be once ation, moved that the resolutions lie on the table, and be known throughout the country that such prospects printed for the use of the House. are held out in the army, that it is a great institution Mr. EVERETT, of Massachusetts, referring to the dif for the instruction of the American youth in the science ficulty experienced in getting up again business once laid of arts, and arms, and morals, at the public expense, on the table, and to the impropriety of giving the go-by and it would be found that no recruiting officers, nor to a subject of such high importance as that now under bounties, nor premiums, would be required to enlist consideration, wished his colleague to withdraw his motion, men; but, on the contrary, the ranks would be crowded, and let these resolutions go to a Committee of the Whole, indeed, there would be more applicants for admission in as proposed by the mover. VOL. VIII.-93 Mr. DAVIS, yielding to the request of his friends, withdrew his motion. Mr. WILDE, of Georgia, renewed the motion to lay the resolutions on the table. Mr. EVERETT, of Mass., then said that this was a question so important, under the circumstances, that he felt it his duty to ask that it be decided by yeas and nays. The yeas and nays were ordered accordingly; and the motion to lay upon the table not admitting of debate, the question was immediately taken upon that motion, and decided as follows: WEDNESDAY, JANUARY 4. PUBLIC LANDS. [JAN. 4, 1832. The House resumed the consideration of the resolution submitted by Mr. MERCER yesterday-the question being on the motion to lay the resolutions on the table; which motion was determined in the affirmative, by yeas and nays, as follows: YEAS.--Messrs. Alexander, R. Allen, Allison, Anderson, Angel, Arnold, Ashley, Babcock, N. Barber, J. S. Barbour, Barnwell, Barstow, James Bates, Beardsley, YEAS.--Messrs. Adair, Alexander, Robert Allen, An- Bell, John Blair, Boon, Bouck, Bouldin, Branch, Briggs, derson, Angel, Archer, Ashley, John S. Barbour, Barn- John Brodhead, Bullard, Burges, Cahoon, Cambreleng, well, J. Bates, Beardsley, Bell, Bergen, Bethune, James Carr, Carson, Chandler, Chinn, Choate, Claiborne, Clay, Blair, John Blair, Boon, Bouck, Bouldin, Brodhead, Cam- Coke, Collier, Condit, Bates Cooke, Daniel, Davenport, breleng, Carr, Carson, Chandler, Chinn, Clay, Coke, W. R. Davis, Dayan, Dewart, Doubleday, Drayton, DunConner, Davenport, Warren R. Davis, Dayan, Double- can, Felder, Findlay, Fitzgerald, Ford, Foster, Gaither, day, Drayton, Ellsworth, Felder, Findlay, Fitzgerald, Gilmore, Griffin, T. H. Hall, Wm. Hall, Harper, Hawes, Foster, Gaither, Gilmore, Griffin, Thomas H. Hall, Wil- Hoffman, Hogan, Holland, Howard, Hubbard, Ihrie, Inliam Hall, Harper, Hawes, Hoffman, Hogan, Holland, gersoll, Irvin, Isacks, Jarvis, Jewett, R. M. Johnson, Cave Hubbard, Irvin, Isacks, Jarvis, Jenifer, Jewett, Richard Johnson, Charles C. Johnston, Kavanagh, Adam King, M. Johnson, Cave Johnson, Charles C. Johnston, Kava- John King, Henry King, Lamar, Lansing, Leavitt, Lenagh, Adam King, John King, Henry King, Lamar, Lan- compte, Lent, Lewis, Lyon, Mann, Mardis, Mason, Maxsing, Leavitt, Lecompte, Lent, Lewis, Lyon, Mann, Mar- well, McCarty, Wm. McCoy, McDuffie, McIntire, T. R. dis, Mason, McCarty, William McCoy, McDuffie, McIn- Mitchell, Muhlenberg, Newnan, Nuckolls, Patton, Pearce, tire, Thomas R. Mitchell, Newnan, Nuckolls, Patton, Pierson, Pitcher, Plummer, Pulk, E. C. Reed, Rencher, Pierson, Pitcher, Plummer, Polk, E. C. Reed, Rencher, Roane, Root, Russel, Smith, Soule, Southard, Speight, Roane, Root, Wm. B. Shepard, Soule, Speight, Standi- Stanberry, Standifer, Stephens, Francis Thomas, Philefer, John Thomson, Verplanck, Ward, Wardwell, Wash-mon Thomas, Wiley Thompson, Tracy, Verplanck, Vinington, Wayne, Weeks, Wilde.--99. ton, Wardwell, Wayne, Weeks, Wilkin, E. D. White, Wilde, Worthington.-124. NAYS.-Messrs. Adams, Chilton Allan, Allison, Appleton, Armstrong, Arnold, Babcock, Banks, Noyes Barber, NAYS.--Messrs. Adams, Appleton, Armstrong, Banks, Barringer, Barstow, Isaac C. Bates, Briggs, Bucher, Bul- Barringer, Bethune, Bucher, Burd, Lewis Condict, E. lard, Burd, Burges, Cahoon, Choate, Collier, Lewis Con- Cooke, Cooper, Coulter, Craig, Crane, Crawford, Creighdict, Silas Condit, Eleutheros Cooke, Bates Cooke, Cooper, ton, John Davis, Dearborn, Denny, Dickson, Ellsworth, Corwin, Coulter, Crane, Crawford, Creighton, Daniel, George Evans, Joshua Evans, Edward Everett, Horace John Davis, Dearborn, Denny, Dewart, Dickson, Dun- Everett, Grennell, Heister, Hughes, Hunt, Huntington, can, George Evans, Joshua Evans, Edward Everett, Ho- Jenifer, Kendall, Kennon, Letcher, Marshall, Robert Mcrace Everett, Ford, Grennell, Heister, Hughes, Hunt, Coy, McKennan, Mercer, Milligan, Newton, Pendleton, Huntington, Ihrie, Ingersoll, Kennon, Kerr, Letcher, Mar- Potts, Randolph, John Reed, Aug. H. Shepperd, Slade, shall, Maxwell, Robert McCoy, McKennan, Mercer, Milli- Stewart, Taylor, Tompkins, Vance, Washington, Elisha gan, Muhlenberg, Newton, Pearce, Pendleton, Potts, Ran- Whittlesey, Frederick Whittlesey, Young.--54. dolph, John Reed, Russel, Aug. H. Shepperd, Slade, After disposing of a large number of other resolutions-Smith, Southard, Stanberry, Stephens, Stewart, Taylor, P. Thomas, Tompkins, Tracy, Vance, Vinton, Watmough, Wilkin, Wheeler, Elisha Whittlesey, Frederick Whittlesey, Edward D. White, Wickliffe, Williams, Worthington, Young.-89. So the motion of Mr. PENDLETON was ordered to lie on the table. PUBLIC LANDS. The House resumed the consideration of the resolution moved some days ago by Mr. BLAIR, as modified on the suggestion of Mr. VINTON, with amendments thereto proposed by Mr. DUNCAN and Mr. MITCHELL, proposing certain modes of hereafter disposing of the public lands, appropriating them to the use of the several States for the purposes of education and internal improvement, or otherwise disposing of them to the States; and a motion having been made to refer the whole of the propositions to a Committee of the Whole on the state of Union Mr. MERCER submitted the following resolution: Resolved, That so soon as the public debt of the United States shall have been discharged, or such provision made therefor, as shall release the public lands from the claims of the public creditors, the nett proceeds of the sales of those lands shall be applied, under such regulations as the After a few remarks from Mr. MERCER, which Legislatures of the several States and Territories may re- were understood as expressive of his assent that the respectively provide, in the proportion of one moiety to po- solution and amendment should go to a Committee of pular education, and the other to the removal of such free the Whole on the state of the Union, for a full and free people of color thereof, as may desire to emigrate to Li-discussion-beria, in Africa, or elsewhere beyond the limits of the United States and of their Territories. Resolved, That, in effecting the preceding purposes, the proceeds of the sales of the public lands be distributed among the several States and Territories according to their respective numbers. Mr. M. moved that it be committed to a Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union; when A motion was made by Mr. CLAY that it be laid on the table; upon which latter motion, Mr. WILLIAMS, of N. C., called for the yeas and nays, which were ordered; but, before the question was taken, The House adjourned. Mr. VINTON said he very much regretted that the proposition made by himself, and so kindly accepted by the gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. BLAIR] as a substitute for his original resolution, should have given rise to a protracted debate. He offered it, not for the purpose of exciting debate, but under the hope that the subject would be put at rest, by legislating upon it at the present session. But if the motion now made to refer the resolution to a Committee of the Whole on the state of the Union, in which the gentleman from Virginia [Mr. MERCER] has expressed his acquiescence, shall prevail, he should consider the subject as postponed for the present session. It was unusual to refer to that committee a mere resolution JAN. 4, 1832.] Public Lands. [H. of R. of inquiry into the expediency of legislating on any sub-be glad to add to his little possessions for himself or his ject. In that committee important principles are assert- children. Suppose, sir, a demagogue who wants to come ed, and the purposes of the House expressed; but, in the into this House, or has the loftier ambition to become the present case, the resolution asserts no principle, states no tenant of the mansion at the other end of the Avenue, fact, nor expresses any purpose beyond that of mere in- should go by himself or his partisan to one of these honest quiry. If the House go into that committee, we shall find men, and say to him "do not you want the tract of Governourselves at sea without compass or rudder; and after de- ment land that lies next to your improvement?" His anbating at random some two or three weeks, without any swer would be, yes; but I am not able to pay for it. He thing to act upon in a tangible form, the subject will in all would next tell him that the Government ought to give probability be abandoned in despair, or thrown aside in him the land--that it had no use for the money, and could disgust. Even if a bill should be ordered to be reported, not use the land. That, by electing him or his candidate, it would come in too late to have any chance of passing he would get it for him for nothing. How long, sir, do into a law. Propositions similar to the one now under you think it would be before that man would feel that it consideration have been made from session to session for was oppression in his Government to withhold from him several years past, but they had been invariably laid aside that which he so much wanted, and the Government could as of little moment. He could assure the House that the do nothing with, and had no need of? Under the stimu time was near at hand when this subject could not be put lants which such agents would not fail to administer to the off, and it was even now dangerous to delay it. If we passions and interests of a people so circumstanced, you contemplate the public land system in its various relations might as well think to smother the rising eruption of as a branch of the public revenue, the extent of country Etna or Vesuvius, as to attempt to keep down popular over which it operates, the number of people who feel its excitement on this subject. A speedy disruption of the influence, it will be found to be entitled to the considerate land system would inevitably follow, and we should see a attention of the House, and to a place in the first class of fund of incalculable value dissipated and forever lost in the great interests of the nation. Hitherto the pledge some great agrarian law, that would bring down with it upon the public domain for the payment of the public debt, ruin upon thousands. has operated as a balance-wheel to the system, and regu Nothing, said Mr. V., will present an effectual barrier lated its movements. But the speedy extinction of that against such a state of things, but the creation of a new debt was now admitted by all to be near at hand. It was pledge of the proceeds of the public lands to some great also admitted by all, that, after the payment of the debt, public purpose or purposes of acknowledged utility, to the revenue arising from the public lands, amounting now take effect so soon as the existing pledge is discharged. It to about three millions per annum, would not he wanted would then become the interest of gentlemen in this House to defray the ordinary expenditures of the Government. from all parts of the country to watch over and take care Public attention is directed to the necessity of devising of this fund. The benefits arising from such a disposition some method of getting rid of this branch of the revenue, of it would probably quiet all discontent, and give increas to avoid an accumulation in the treasury after that event. ed stability to the value of public and private property in With this view, the Secretary of the Treasury has recommended the entire disposition of the public lands in a par ticular way, and propositions for a specific appropriation of their proceeds, some to one object and some to another, are made from all sides of the House. the Western country. The time has not yet come, and will not until after the next Presidential election, when the condition of the treasury will be such as has been spoken of. The present is therefore a favorable time, and, in all probability, the only time to meet this question Imagine, said Mr. V., the public debt to be paid, and an and dispose of it judiciously and dispassionately. If this accumulation of money in the treasury arising from the session is permitted to pass away, be assured the golden proceds of the public domain, which the Government has opportunity is lost. Before the next session, another no occasion to use, but which of necessity must flow in Presidential election will have taken place. New aspirants upon it, while the land system remains as at present or- for power will spring up; new parties will be formed here ganized. And then, sir, permit me to direct your atten- and in the country-every topic of popular excitement tion to the condition of things in the great extent of will be greedily seized upon; and even at the very next country embraced by the land system, and to the influ- session, if you approach the question, you may feel the ences that would be likely to grow out of it. Over a very ground tremble under your feet, and find you have begun large portion of that country, the exactions of the Go- when you have no power to act. vernment for the public lands are regarded as a burden, from which the people would gladly be relieved. Mr. V. said he hoped he had said enough to satisfy the House as to the necessity of acting upon this subject This feeling of uneasiness has manifested itself for some without loss of time. But if the resolution should be sent years past in various ways, and in some of the new States to the Committee on the state of the Union, he should the doctrine has been boldly advanced by the public func- wholly despair of any legislation upon it this session. He tionaries, and in a temper, too, best calculated to excite was desirous, in the first instance, of an inquiry into the discontent, that the public domain is the property of the whole subject, and when a bill and report should come in, people and States respectively within whose limits it is let them be referred to the committee now proposed; the situated; and, consequently, that the exactions of the House would then be able to act understandingly, and he Government are unjust and oppressive in compelling the hoped finally, upon it. He wanted to see a report that people to pay for that which already belongs to them. should present the subject in all its bearings upon the Of all the interests that appertain to any Government, great interests of the country, private as well as public. there is none about which the great body of the people feel It was a question in which a vast amount of private as so deeply, and may be so easily excited, as upon a ques-well as public property was to be affected. There were tion respecting the right of soil. many new members here who could not be presumed to In that country there are now more free inhabitants be familiar with the subject of the public domain; and so than these United States contained at the close of the war complicated and voluminous were our laws respecting it, of the revolution. It is a community, too, essentially agri-filling a volume of more than a thousand pages, that very cultural, and of course attaches more value to land than few even of the old members have either the courage or any other description of population. In all that region leisure to attempt to become masters of them. A report, of country you will scarcely find a man of that class of therefore, was obviously necessary before we had the people, who, when he stands at his cabin door, does not debate. daily see a tract of land belonging to you, that he would There was always, even when a distinct proposition was He [JAN. 5, 1832 So the whole subject was ordered to lie on the table. THURSDAY, JANUARY 5. POSTAGES. before the House, a centrifugal tendency in its debates, Kendall, Kennon, Leavitt, Marshall, Maxwell, R. McCoy, and when there was no definite question, the debate McKennan, Mercer, Milligan, Newton, J. Reed, Rencher, usually ran wholly astray. The debate upon this resolution Shepperd, Slade, Stanberry, Standifer, Stewart, Taylor, affords a striking illustration of this remark. A gentle F. Thomas, J. Thomson, Tompkins, Vance, Vinton, man from New York, who took part in it, had brought a Wardwell, Wheeler, E. Whittlesey, E. D. White, Wilsort of writ of right in favor of his State against the State liams, Young.-70. of Virginia, for something like half the continent. argued it with much ability for some two or three days, during the hour allotted to resolutions. Without meaning any rebuke to the gentleman for introducing that topic, it must be admitted that so long as no one disputed the present title of the United States, its bearing upon the The House proceeded to consider the following resolu resolution is not very obvious. But if the resolution goes tion, moved by Mr. HEISTER on the 22d of December to the Committee on the state of the Union, this contro- ultimo: versy will probably become the leading topic of debate. Resolved, That the Postmaster General be directed to The gentlemen who represent the ancient commonwealth furnish this House a statement of the annual amount of of Virginia, whose jurists, above all others, are experienc- postage received on newspapers and periodicals for the ed in questions of prior appropriation and disputed boun- preceding five years, designating the amount received on dary, will no doubt make an imposing reply to the gentle- each. Also, his views on the expediency or inexpediency man from New York. Mr. V. said, the further prosecution of abolishing the postage on newspapers and periodicals, of the debate in the manner in which it would probably or either of them. be pursued, could not but be unprofitable to the House, Mr. TAYLOR observed that the practice of the House and hazardous to the question. He therefore hoped some heretofore had been to call on the Executive Departgentleman who felt an interest in it would bring the House ments for statements of fact, and for the House to form its to a direct vote upon the original resolution, by moving own judgment as to the expediency of any measures which the previous question. He would make the motion him- were to be founded upon them. Where the House knew, self; but, after what he had said, it would be ungracious in from the departments, what was the amount of the revehim to do so. nue, and the objects to which it ought to be applied, it could judge for itself of the expediency of applying the money arising from a particular branch of revenue to any given purpose. It was from no want of due respect for the officer at the head of the Post Office Department that he objected to the resolution, but from an unwillingness that the House should place itself in the attitude of asking the views and opinions of one of the officers of the Govern ment on a subject upon which the House was bound by its responsibility to the people to judge for itself, and act accordingly. Mr. WICKLIFFE, of Kentucky, observed that a call for the previous question, as suggested by the gentleman who had just taken his seat, would not only be very ungracious in that gentleman, but very unkind, if made by any other member, so long as some gentlemen might feel themselves called on to offer a reply to some of the gentleman's remarks, particularly those which seemed to imply some censure on the new States. But, as the whole subject was before the Committee on Public Lands, he had concluded that a resolution like the present ought not to have occupied the time of the House in its discussion. In order, however, to try the feeling of the House, he would, though not calling for the previous question, move that the resolution and amendments be laid on the table. On this motion, Mr. BLAIR, of Tennessee, demanded the yeas and nays; which were ordered accordingly, and taken as follows: Mr. McDUFFIE would not say but that the words of the resolution might be improved: but he thought the most material object of the call would be defeated if some. thing of the same kind as that objected to by the gentleman from New York should not be contained in it. The Postmaster General was certainly more competent to judge what would be the effect on the operations of that department from a measure like that proposed in the YEAS.—Messrs. Adams, Adair, Alexander, Anderson, resolution, than any other person could be; and he thought Angel, Babcock, Banks, J. S. Barbour, Barnwell, Bar- there was no impropriety in asking his opinion in referstow, J. Bates, Bergen, Bethune, James Blair, Boon, ence to the proposed change in its arrangements, and its Bouck, Bouldin, Branch, John Brodhead, J. C. Brodhead, effect on the capacity of the department to discharge the Bullard, Cambreleng, Carr, Carson, Chandler, Chinn, functions assigned to it without calling upon the treasury. Choate, Claiborne, Clay, Coke, Collier, Conner, Cooper, It was important to have the judgment of such an officer, Davenport, W. R. Davis, Dayan, Dewart, Dickson, Dou- whether the department would be able to sustain itself, bleday, Drayton, Felder, Findlay, Ford, Foster, Gaither, should the postage on newspapers and periodicals be Gilmore, Griffin, T. H. Hall, Hammons, Harper, Heister, abolished. He, therefore, suggested the propriety of Hogan, Holland, Howard, Hubbard, Ihrie, Irvin, Jarvis, modifying the resolution, by substituting for its latter Jenifer, Jewett, R. M. Johnson, C. Johnson, C. C. Jolin clause words to this effect, "and, also, what will be effect ston, Kavanagh, A. King, J. King, H. King, Lamar, of abolishing such postage on the revenue and operations Lansing, Lecompte, Lent, Lyon, Mann, Mardis, Mason, of the Post Office Department." McCarty, W. McCoy, McDuffie, McIntire, T. R. Mitchell, Mr. CARSON suggested the propriety of further mo- NAYS.-Messrs. C. Allan, R. Allen, Allison, Appleton, Armstrong, Arnold, Barber, Bell, John Blair, Briggs, Bucher, Burd, Cahoon, Condict, Condit, E. Cooke, B.Cooke, Coulter, Craig, Crane, Crawford, Creighton, J. Davis, Dearborn, Denny, Duncan, Ellsworth, G. Evans, J. Evans, E. Everett, H. Everett, Fitzgerald, Grennell, W. Hall, Hawes, Hoffman, Hughes, Hunt, Huntington, Ingersoll, Isacks, Mr. HEISTER agreed to the modification proposed by Mr. McDUFFIE, and so far to that of Mr. CARSON as to substitute three years for five. Mr. INGERSOLL observed that the effect of the proposed measure on the revenue of the department would be known of course to the House when it received an ac count of the amount of postage. All that it need to ask from the Postmaster General, was the effect on the operations of the department, JAN. 5, 1832.] Rules of Proceeding. [H. of R. Mr. RUSSEL, chairman of that committee, having nodded assent to this inquiry, Mr. CARSON said that he felt regret at being obliged to make the motion he was now about to propose, since the resolution had been offered by a young member, who might consider himself not courteously treated; but he was constrained to move that the resolution and amendment should be laid on the table. He, however, withdrew the motion, at the request of Mr. RUSSEL, of Ohio, who stated that the whole subject was now before the Post Office Committee, and that, as chairman of that committee, he had called upon the Postmaster General for precisely the same information referred to in the resolution. Mr. ARNOLD thereupon withdrew his amendment; and Mr. CARSON renewed his motion to lay the resolution on the table; which was carried, yeas 91; and the resolution was laid on the table accordingly. RULES OF PROCEEDING. Mr. EVERETT, of Massachusetts, observed that the subject was one of considerable interest, respecting which he had received directions from his constituents, and he feared that, should the resolution pass in its present form, that which was most needed would not be obtained. The resolution proposed an inquiry only into the effect of a total abolition of the postage on newspapers and periodicals. Now, it had been stated to him by those most concerned, that a total abolition would be very inexpedient; that the probable effect would be, to produce such a flood of these publications as would break down the mail, and be attended with such great inconveniences that the law would very speedily be repealed. It would be better, he thought, to inquire what would be the effect of reducing, as well as abolishing, this branch of revenue; and he should be glad to see the inquiry extended to one point further. He meant to the postage on letters. Letter postage was one of the heaviest taxes paid by the people of the United States. It was more universal in its extent than any other, and in its practical operation exceedingly unequal. The requiring double postage on double letters was not regulated on equal principles. The postage was doubled for the smallest and lightest enclosure; a bank note or a receipt paid as much as the largest letter; and also, in appor- Resolved, That so much of the seventeenth rule of this tioning the postage to the distance, the law was very House as limits the presentation of reports and resolutions unequal and oppressive. The restriction of no tax would to one hour, be rescinded. come home to the business of a large number of the citi- Mr. TAYLOR said the practice of offering resolutions zens, or be attended with a greater increase of the comforts to be referred to committees, had grown up to a considerof life than this; he did not wish to interfere with or em-able extent in a few years. For a long time after he had barrass the operations of the department, so as to make it the honor of a seat in the House, private claims were not a charge on the revenue, nor did he think that such would urged there by resolutions, but by petitions. It was thought be the result of the measure proposed. It would occasion then that the members composing the committees of that no reduction in the actual amount of revenue, since, House were persons composed of common intelligence, although the postage on a letter might be materially dimin- and possessed some knowledge of the nature of the ished, yet the number of letters transmitted would be great- duties assigned to their care; but, of late, it might almost ly increased. He therefore suggested that the resolution be considered that every individual member appeared be further modified by adopting these or the like words: "also, his opinion as to the effect on the operations of the department from the reduction or abolition of postage on letters, newspapers, and periodicals." The following resolution, offered by Mr. WILLIAMS, was next taken up: to be better informed of the duties of the different committees, than the committees themselves, by the numerous resolutions for instruction which were continually introduced. The practice had extended probably This was accepted as a modification by the mover. beyond what necessity required; and resolutions now enMr. INGERSOLL thought that, in order to accomplish croached much upon the ordinary business of the House. the object in view, the House would require a statement Formerly, when some resolution was found to lead to a of the whole receipts of the department derived from prolonged and useless debate, it was competent in any letters, periodicals, and newspapers, distinctly stated under member to move that the House proceed to the orders of different heads. He believed no branch of the revenue the day, and the House then, at its pleasure, determined would better bear the pruning knife than the tax upon let-whether the matter under consideration was of such imters. It was more emphatically a tax upon the poor. The portance as to supersede the regular order, and acted tax upon newspapers operated upon another class of per- accordingly. Now, as was well known, the practice was sons; when men were restrained from subscribing to a very different. He did not know but that it would be betpaper, it was not by the expense of postage, but by the ter to recur to the old practice of business in this respect, subscription price of the paper. But the poorer citizens but he was averse to a peremptory repeal of the sevenwere restrained from letter writing by a dread of the post-teenth rule, or that part of it which the resolution referage they must pay. red to, and should, therefore, move an amendment to the Mr. ARNOLD said he was desirous of seeing the call so proposition. extended as to call on the Postmaster General to state the After the word "Resolved," strike out the balance of the amount of costs which the department has paid for pub-resolution of the gentleman from North Carolina, and insert, lishing its advertisements throughout the United States; That the seventeenth rule of this House be amended, by and, also, the total number of newspapers published in striking out the following words: “And not more than one the Union. He thought that both these items of inquiry hour in each day shall be devoted to the subject of reports would come very properly within the resolution. He from committees, and resolutions," and, in lieu thereof, therefore proposed a further modification to that effect. Or, should the mover think that he had gone far enough in consenting to modifications, Mr. A would move it as an amendment. Mr. CARSON observed that at a very early day in the session the gentleman from Tennessee [Mr. ARNOLD] had presented a memorial in reference to the Post Office, and had moved for the printing of it. What he wished to know was, whether the consideration of that memorial, and a report upon it, from the Post Office Committee, to whom he understood it had been referred, would not bring up this entire subject. insert: "And after one hour shall have been devoted to reports from committees, and resolutions, it shall be in order, pending the consideration or discussion thereof, to entertain a motion that the House do now proceed to [dispose of the business on the Speaker's table, and to] the orders of the day. The lines within brackets were subsequently inserted at the suggestion of the Speaker, who stated, that otherwise the effect of the resolution, when acted on, would be to sweep off all the bills from the Speaker's table, by proceeding at once from reports and resolutions to the orders of the day. |