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A. D. Russell, Schoonmaker, Seymour, Sherman, prevail. I listened, with a great deal of attention, Van Cott-38.
to the remarks of the gentleman from Ontario Noes-Messrs. A. F. Allen, C. L. Allen, Andrews,[Mr. Folger) on the last clause of this section. I Archer, Axtell, Ballard, Barker, Beadle, Bergen, do not understand that the requiring of members Bickford, Bowen, E. A. Brown, Carpenter, Cor- of the Legislature to take such an oath as that is bett, T. W. Dwight, Endress, Evarts, Folger, a degradation. Every officer in the United States Fowler, Frank, Fuller, Garvin, Gould, Graves, service, at certain periods, whenever he has been Gross, Hadley, Hammond, Hand, Harris, Hitch- promoted, has to take the “ iron-clad oath," and cock, Hitchman, Jarvis, Kernan, Kinney, Krum, that oath does not involve with that officer any Larremore, Lee, Livingston, Ludington, Masten, idea of degradation. Every person who now Merritt, Merwin, A. J. Parker, President, Prindle, takes office in the United States service has to Reynolds, Rogers, Roy, L. W. Russell, Schell, take that oath. If the gentleman from Ontario Schumaker, Seaver, Smith, Spencer, Stratton, [Mr. Folger) shall take his seat as Senator of the Strong, S. Townsend, Van Campen, Wakeman, United States-as I hope he may be compelled to Wales, Wickham, Williams—62.
do at some time he will take that oath and it Mr. VAN CAMPEN–I desire to move a re- will be no degradation. consideration of the vote on the proposition of The PRESIDENT announced the question on the gentleman from Jefferson, [Mr. Merwin]. the amendment of Mr. Hadley.
The PRESIDENT-The motion is not now in The ayes and noes were called for, but not a order.
sufficient number seconding the call they were not The question was then put on the fourth sec- ordered. tion as reported by the Committee of the Whole, Mr. MERRITT—I ask that the question be and it was declared adopted.
divided and the vote taken first on the question as Mr. VAN CAMPEN-I now desire to renew to mileage; second, on the additional compensation my motion to reconsider the vote by which the to the Speaker; and, third, on the oath of memamendment of the gentleman from Jefferson (Mr. bers. Merwin] was lost.
The question was then put on striking out the Objection being made the motion was laid on first subdivision of the section, as follows: the table under the rule.
"And ten cents for each mile they shall travel The SECRETARY proceeded to read section 5, in going to and returning from their place of as reported by the Committee of the Whole, as meeting by the most usual route.” follows:
Which was declared lost, on a division, by a "SEC. 5. The members of the Legislature vote of 19 to 52. shall receive for their services an annual salary of The question was then put on striking out the one thousand dollars, and ten cents for each mile second subdivision of the section, as follows: they shall travel in going to and returning from “The Speaker of the Assembly shall receive au their place of meeting by the most usual route. additional compensation equal to one-half of his The Speaker of the Assembly shall receive an | salary as a member.” additional compensation equal to one-half of his Which was declared lost. salary as a member. No Senator or member of The question was then announced on striking the Assembly shall draw his pay until the close out the third subdivision of the section, as folof each session, when he shall take his oath or lows: affirmation that he has not received, or agreed to "No Senator or member of the Assembly shall receive, nor does he expect to receive, any monoy draw his pay until the close of each session, when or other property for his official vote or other ac- he shall take his oath or affirmation that he has tion, as such Senator or member of the Assembly. not received or agreed to receive nor does he exIf he fails to take such oath or affirmation, he pect to receive any money or other property for shall forfeit his pay and be ineligible to re-elec- his official vote or other action as such Senator or tion."
member of the Assembly. If he fail to take such Mr. MERRITT – I wish to make a verbal oath or affirmation he shall forfeit his pay and be amendment which will require no vote. After ineligible to re-election." the word "shall” insert the word “respectively." Mr. L. W. RUSSELL—I call for the ayes and
There being no objection, the amendment was noes. ordered.
A sufficient number seconding the call, the ayes Mr. SCHOONMAKER-I move to amend by and noes were ordered. adding the amendment I offered in the Committee The SECRETARY called the roll on the pendof the Whole.
ing motion to strike out the third subdivision, and Mr. HADLEY-I move to amend the amend- it was carried by the following vote : ment by striking out all of the section after the Ayes-Messrs. A. F. Allen, C. L. Allen, Alvord, word "dollars," so that it shall then read “mem- Andrews, Archer, Baker, Ballard, Barker, Beadle, bers of the Legislature shall receive for their Beals, Bergen, Bickford, Bowen, E. Brooks, E. P. services an annual salary of one thousand dollars," Brooks, E. A. Brown, W. C. Brown, Burrill, Car. striking out the compensation for travel, and the penter, Case, Champlain, Chesebro, Cooke, Coradditional compensation to the speaker, and the bett, Daly, C. C. Dwight, T. W. Dwight, Endress, remainder of the section.
Evarts, Folger, Fowler, Frank, Fuller, Fullerton, The PRESIDENT — The amendment of the Garvin, Gould, Grant, Graves, Gross, Hadley, gentlemen from Seneca [Mr. Hadley) is first in Hand, Hardenburgh, Harris, Hitchcock, Hitchorder.
man, Jarvis, Kernan, Ketcham, Kinney, Krum, Mr. AXTELL—I hope this amendment will not Larremore, Law, A. Lawrence, A. R. Lawrenco,
Lee, Livingston, Lowrey Ludington, McDonald, members ordinarily have; and my experience is Merritt. Merwin, Monell
, Morris, President, Prin- that the increased expense to the Speaker, in an dle, Prosser, Rathbun, Reynolds, Robertson, ordinary session of the Legislature, amounts to Rogers, Roy, Rumsey, A. D. Russell, Schell, about two hundred and fifty dollars above the Schoonmaker, Schumaker, Sherman, Spencer, expenses of other members. Stratton, Strong, Van Campen, Van Cott, Wake Mr. WEED--As I understand it, the Speaker man, Wales, Wickham, Williams—86.
of the Assembly has other duties to perform. He Noes-Messrs. Axtell, Conger, Corning, Gree- is a member of several boards. ley, Hammond, M. H. Lawrence, Masten, A. J. Mr. ALVORD-He is paid for those extra serParker, L. W. Russell
, Seymour, Smith, S. Town- vices by a per diem allowance, and has been ever send-12.
since the Constitution of 1846 was adopted. The PRESIDENT then announced the question Mr. WEED-But if I recollect right, this very on the amendment of Mr. Schoonmaker, which next sentence prohibits any such payment for the Secretary read as follows:
extra services, This extra five hundred dollars Add to the section :
is in lieu of all such fees. No member of either branch of the Legislature Mr. ALVORD—Then two hundred and fifty shall either directly or indirectly demand or re- dollars is not enough. ceive from any source any other or additional Mr. BARKER-I hope that the extra sum compensation of any character or description than which has been suggested as the compensation that above provided, for any services rendered by of the Speaker will not be diminished. If he is him in relation to any matter before the Legisla- entitled to any sum it certainly ought to be five ture, or any of the committees thereof, during the hundred dollars. Every gentleman who is actime for which he was elected; and any member quainted with public life knows that the presidwho shall either directly or indirectly demand or ing officer has many hospitalities to extend, and receive any such other or additional compensa- they certainly increase his expenses. The gention, his seat shall be declared vacant and he tleman from Onondaga [Mr. Alvord] must have shall be deemed guilty of bribery and corruption been very sparing in his entertainments as Speakand punishable therefor.
er if it did not cost him more than two hundred Mr. VAN CAMPEN-I desire to say that what and fifty dollars .extra. Then the Speaker has the gentleman seeks is provided for in the article other duties to perform, and should receive addion suffrage, in the amendment of the gentleman tional compensation for them. I hope that herefrom New York (Mr. Burrill].
after the supply bill will not present these items Mr. SCHOONMAKER_I call for the ayes and for extra pay for Speakers, Lieutenant-Governors, noes on the amendment.
and other officers. Not a sufficient number seconding the call the Mr. BERGEN-I move the previous question. ayes and noes were not ordered.
The question was put on ordering the previous The question was then put on the amendment question, and it was declared carried, of Mr. Schoonmaker, and it was declared lost. The question was then put on the amendment
Mr. CONGER-I offer the following amend of Mr. Alvord, and it was declared lost. ment:
The question was then announced on the amendStrike out after the word "services," "and ment offered by Mr. Conger. insert "a sum not exceeding six dollars a day The ayes and noes were called for, but not a from the commencement of the session, but such sufficient number seconding the call, they were not pay shall not exceed six hundred dollars in the ordered. aggregate, except in proceedings for impeach The question was then put on the amendment ment."
of Mr. Conger, and it was declared lost. Mr. ALVORD—I am entirely opposed to the The question then recurred on section 5 as amendment offered by the gentleman from Rock- amended, and it was declared adopted. land (Mr. Conger], because it is going back to a Mr. BICKFORD-I move a reconsideration of systein which has been shown to be very inju- the vote by which the amendment of the gentlerious in the past. It is absolutely in effect man from St. Lawrence (Mr. L. W. Russel]] was restricting the term of the Legislature to one stricken out. hundred days. I prefer to give members a fixed Objection being made, the motion was laid over sum and leave the question of the duration of the under the rule. session to the convenience and judgment of the The SECRETARY then proceeded to read the Legislature. But, sir, in regard to the other mat- sixth section, as reported by the Committee of the ter proposed—that is, the additional pay of the whole, as follows: Speaker-I desire to offer as an amendment, to SEC. 6. No member of the Legislature shall be apinsert "one-quarter" in place of "one-half"—that pointed to any civil office within this State by the is, two hundred and fifty dollars instead of five hun-Governor, the Governor and Senate, or by the dred dollars in excess of the pay of members; Legislature during the time for which he shall and I desire to say a very few words on that have been elected, and all such appointments and point. The Speaker should not by any means be all votes given for any such member therefor shall permitted to have anything more in the way of be void. Nor shall any person being a member compensation than other members. He is the of Congress or holding any judicial or military peer of members-nothing more and nothing less; office under the United States hold a seat in the but the position which he occupies, as a matter Legislature. If any person shall, after his elecof necessity, makes it requisite that he should tion as a member of the Legislature, be elected have more expensive apartments than other to Congress or appointed to any office, civil or
military, under the government of the United , that provision. That was the case of Mr. States, his acceptance thereof shall vacate his Talmadge. seat.
A DELEGATE - That was before 1846. Mr. A. J. PARKER--I wish to offer an amend. Mr. FOLGER — But it was under a similar ment to this section. I propose to strike out all provision in the Constitution of 1821. down to and including the word "void," in line five, Mr. RATHBUN- The question was then raised and insert in lieu thereof the language of our in the Senate as to the validity of his election; present Constitution, as follows:
but the Senate declared his right to hold his seat, "No member of the Legislalure shall be ap on the ground that under the Constitution of the pointed to any civil office within this State, or to United States he was qualified for the position the Senate of the United States, by the Gov. for which he was elected. The general judgment ernor, the Governor and Senate, or from the Leg. of the Legislature last year was that the proislature, during the time for which he shall have vision was wholly inoperative, and of no effect. been elected, and all such appointments and all That being so, is it worth while to insert in the votes given for every such member for any such Constitution a provision, to be disregarded when office or appointment shall be void.”
the question of the election of a United States The change that is proposed by the committee Senator shall come up? It seems to me that we would leave the members of the Legislature had better omit it. eligible to the Senate of the United States. It Mr. MASTEN I hope the amendment of the has been prohibited heretofore expressly, under gentleman from Albany (Mr. A. J. Parker] will the present Constitution, and so it was supposed not prevail. I suppcse that the qualifications of a to be under the previous Constitution. I prefer, Senator of the United States are to be determined for one, that it should be retained. It is true it by the Constitution of the United States, and has been said that if the Legislature should elect that only those qualifications which are prescribed one of its members to the United States Senate, by the Constitution of the United States are necesthe United States Senate could not deprive him sary, and that if this provision was inserted in our of his seat; but that is not the question. Such Constitution, it would be a nullity. I am opposed an election would nevertheless be unconstitutional. to having any provision incorporated in our ConIt would be in violation of our State Constitution. stitution, that will conflict with the Constitution No member of the Legislature can vote for any of the United States. member of the Legislature for Senator without Mr. MERRITT — I desire to say that ro harm violating his oath, in which he has sworn to sup- can come from leaving out of the Constitution the port the Constitution of the State. I believe that existing provision in reference to the election of it is a salutary restriction. It sometimes hap- United States Senators. The election must take pens—and it has happened, doubtless, to many of place on the second Tuesday after the annual ns—that we would prefer some member of the meeting of the Legislature, and no bad results Legislature for the Senate. But I believe that, could possibly follow. The fact that a member of unless this restriction is retained, the Legislature the Legislature was a candidate for office would will always be able to control the matter to that have but very little weight at the commencement extent, that no one except one of its members can of a session, and of course he would vacate his be elected to the United States Senate. To repeal position immediately upon being elected to that this restriction would introduce into the Legisla- office. ture intrigues, log-rolling and fraud. The temp Mr. BARKER —I desire to say one word on tation to purchase an election by such means this subject. A member of the Legislature is the would be great and dangerous, and I hope we only person disqualitied, by any positive provision shall retain the clause in the Constitution as it in our Constitution, from being eligible to the has existed for the last twenty years.
office of United States Senator. It is true that Mr. MERRITT — It has been held that the the Constitution of the United States provides qualifications of a Senator of the United States the qualifications which must be observed; and are prescribed by the Constitution of the United one of the reasons of the committee recommendStates, and, as I remarked a few days ago, when ing this provision to be stricken out was this, the subject was up for consideration in Committee that the Senate of the United States, being the of the whole, there is a difference of opinion as judge of the qualifications of its own members, to the validity of such a provision in the Consti- would disregard the qualifications which are tution. The fact is well known that, at the elec- exacted by a State Constitution. Yet, if, in tion of a Senator of the United States by the last times of high political excitement, they were to Legislature, the democratic party voted unitedly exclude a member, they might then fall back for a member of the State Senate: and they held upon the provision of a State Constitution, and that they could legally and properly do so. We say that the Legislature of a State had not thought best, therefore, to omit this from the observed this qualification, prescribed by article, and to leaye the question entirely open. the Constitution of the State, and thereby No great harm could come of it.
exclude a person elected by the LegislaMr. RATHBUN - This provision now offered ture. We wish to have it rest wholly on the by way of amendment has been in the Constitu- rule prescribed by the Constitution of the United tion of the State since 1846. Every delegate on States, and then it will be uniform in all the this floor, I presume, will remember that a mem- States. ber of the Legislature was elected a United States Mr. VAN CAMPEN-I move the previous Senator, while a member of the Legislature, while question. serving in the State Senate, notwithstanding The question was put on the motion of Mr. Van
Campen for the previous question, and it was de- / would urge in favor of this change are brief clared carried on a division by a vote of 39 to 28. these: The month of December is one of th
Mr. HUTCHINS—There was no quorum voted. dullest in the year to the larger proportion o
The PRESIDENT — There being no quorum those who compose the Assembly. It is so wit: voting, the question will again be put on ordering the merchant, the manufacturer, the mechanic an the previous question.
the farmer, and we all know that these classes ar The question was again put, on ordering the always largely represented at least in the lowe previous question, and it was again declared house of the Legislature. The Legislature nov carried by a vote of 48 to 35.
convenes on the first Tuesday of January, and it is The question was then announced on the proposed to continue that arrangement. The ex amendment offered by Mr. A. J. Parker.
perience of the past shows us that from three to The ayes and noes were called, but not a suffin four months is always consumed each year by cient number seconding the call
, they were not the legislative session. I fully believe that this ordered.
period is necessary to secure safe and proper legThe question was put on the amendment of islation for the State. The difficulty with the Mr. A. J. Parker, and it was declared lost. Legislature meeting on the first of January is,
The question was then put on the sixth section, that as spring approaches, the merchants, manuas reported by the Committee of the Whole, and facturers, mechanics, and farmers of the body it was declared adopted.
become restless and anxious to return to their Mr. FULLERTON - I move a reconsideration homes. This is especially true with the farmer. of the vote by which section 5 was adopted. When the first of April arrives it becomes abso.
Objection being made, the motion was laid over lutely necessary that all such should go home. under the rules.
Go they must, let the consequences be what they Mr. A. J. PARKER-I wish to move a recon- may. Their business demands it, and then besideration of the last vote taken.
gins hasty and ill-advised legislation. Through the Objection being made, the motion laid over process of grinding committees hundreds of bills under the rules.
are passed which are never read, and the contents The SECRETARY proceeded to read section of which are unknown to very many of the mem7, as reported by the Committee of the Whole, bers. "I believe this evil may be very much coras follows:
rected by having the legislative year commence at SEC. 7. The elections of Senators and members of such a time that the four comparatively dull ard Assembly under this Constitution shall be held on idle months of December, January, February and the Tuesday succeeding the first Monday in March could be devoted, if required, to the busiNovember, unless otherwise directed by law. ness of legislation. I cannot conceive of a single The first election to be in the year one thousand argument that can be made against this amend. eight hundred and sixty-eight. The legislativement that cannot be met and refuted. term shall begin on the first day of January, and Mr. FOLGER-I understood the amendment the Legislature shall every year assemble on the of the gentleman from Orange (Mr. Fullerton] to first Tuesday in January, unless a different day be to strike out the word " January” wherever be appointed by law. The Senators and members it occurs, and to insert “ December" in place of of Assembly who may be in office on the first it. But, “January” stricken out of the ninth day of January, one thousand eight hundred and line and “December” inserted, would leave a sixty-eight, shall hold their offices until and in- double Legislature for one part of the year. I cluding the thirty-first day of December of that think the amendment proposed by the gentleman year, and no longer.
from Orange, ought to be corrected in that Mr. FULLERTON-I offer the following amend- respect. ment:
Mr. FULLERTON-I accept the amendment. Strike out the word "January” wherever it Mr. FOLGER—Then, to make the amendment occurs, and in lieu thereof insert the word “De-plain, the word - thirty-one" should be stricken cember," and strike out the word “thirty" in ont in the eleventh line, and the word " Decemline eleven.
ber" in the ninth line, and the words "thirtieth We have already agreed, Mr. Chairman, on of November" inserted in their place. some provisions which we all hope will aid in Mr. GREELEY-I beg the Convention to repromotiog one great end we have in view, and member that this will bring the whole flood of that is to prevent corrupt legislation. I believe Federal and State documents at once before the we may go still further and do something to people and choke up the newspapers, so much so, diminish hasty and ill-advised legislation. The that we cannot do anything at all. (Laughter.] amendment proposed by me looks to this result. The question was put on the amendment of Mr. When we shall have concluded our labors, I trust Fullerton, and it was declared lost. we will have agreed upon a provision that will The SECRETARY proceeded to read the eighth limit the power of the Legislature to legislate on section, reported by the Committee of the whole, matters purely local in their character. Also, that as follows: we will agree that members of the Legislature Sec. 8. A majority of each House shall constitute shall be paid a compensation that will in some a quorum to do business. Each House shall dedegree remove the temptation to accept bribes. termine the rules of its own proceedings, and be And I trust we will have agreed that the legisla- the judge of the election returns and qualificative year should commence on the 1st of Decem- tions of its own members; shall choose its own ber, and that the Legislature should convene on officers; and the Senate shall choose a temporary the first Tuesday of that month. The reasons I resident when the Lieutenant-Governor
shall not attend as president, or shall act as Mr. C. C. DWIGHT—I would suggest that the Governor,
gentleman add the words " for the same offense." Mr. PRINDLE - I offer the following amend Mr. RUMSEY-I accept that suggestion. bent:
Mr. C. C. DWIGHT - It seems to me neces. Add to the end of section eight the following sary to attain the object desired to provide further * The Secretary of State shall call the Assembly that a member shall not be expelled except for that to order at the opening of each new Assembly session. Surely, if a man is expelled at one sesand preside over it until a presiding officer there. sion of the Legislature, if he goes back again the of shall have been elected and shall have taken next session, le should not be expelled again for Lis seat."
the same offense. I desire very briefly to explain why I offer this Mr. GARVIN-He may be turned out by reason amendment. It is customary now for the clerk of some prejudice and his constituency agaio of the previous Assembly to preside over the As- return him. The object of this is to provide sembly until a Speaker is elected. But the clerk against expulsion a second time. He may sub. has no sort of authority to preside, and it is mit the question of his expulsion to his con. merely by courtesy that he is allowed to do stituency, and if they override the action of 80. It will be recollected that in 1863 a the Legislature and return him, although he great deal of difficulty was experienced in has been expelled, the Legislature shall not the election of a Speaker by the Assembly. turn around and expel him again for the same Some twenty days, or twenty-seven days, as offense. I am informed, were thus occupied, and cer Mr. SEAVER-Is an amendment in order. tainly ten days were occupied after the ma The PRESIDENT—The Chair is of opinion that jority of the members of Assembly desired to it is. proceed to vote, because certain members of the Mr. SEAVER - It is only a word to make the legislature refused to (bey the decision of the vote on expulsion to be by a majority of all the clerk, and refused to all w a call of the roll. The members elected or by two-thirds of those present teul days were spent in futile attempts to call the and voting. toll Subsequently, during that session, a The question was put on the amendment of bill was introduced providing for this difficulty, Mr. Seaver and it was declared lost. but the objection was made that it was uncon The question then recurred on the amendstitutional, because of this section, " that the ment of Mr. Rumsey and it was declared members of the Assembly are to choose their adopted. own officers," and the bill was consequently Mr. GREELEY I move the previous quesatan Ioned, because it was believed to be unconcion. situzional. Now, it seems to me it would The question was put on ihe motion for the mely this difficulty ly providing that the previous question, and it was declared carried.
cretary of State shall call the Assembly to The question then recurred on the eighth section 1. der and preside until a Speaker is elected.' By as amended and it was declared adopted. le law under which we are assembled the Secre. The SECRETARY proceeded to read the tory of State called this Convention to order, and pinth section reported by the Committee of the presided until a presidert was elected; and the Whole as follows: eine plan could be ado; ted with profit, I think, SEC. 9. Each house shall keep a journal of its proin the case of the Assen. bly.
ceedings and publish the same, except such parts The question was put on the amendment of Mr. as may require secrecy. The doors of each hovse Prindle, and it was declared adopted.
shall be kept open, except when the public welMr. FOLGER-I offer the following amend- fare shall require secrecy. Neither house shall, betit. In line 5. after the words "temporary without consent of the other, adjourn for more president." insert “to preside." Under the sec- than two days. ton as it now stands there may be difficulty. A Mr. BARKER - I suggest that there be added Strict construction would seem to require that the at the close of this section the following words: fenile could only choose a temporary president - Nor finally adjourn without the consent of the when the Lieutenaut-Guvernor was away. The Governor.". practice has been to choose a temporary president
SEVERAL DELEGATES- No, no. early in the session of the Senate, who presides Mr. BARKER-- The object of the amendment when the Lieutenant-Governor is away.
is this: There is a great probability that this ConThe question was put on the amendment of Mr. vention will enact a constitutional provision against Polzer, and it was declared adopted.
the Governor exercising the veto power after the Mr. ROMSEY-I offer the following amend. adjournment of the Legislature. Hence the Legisment:
lature should not alljourn while a bill is before "No member shall be expelled by either house the Governor, receiving his cousideration. It ercept by a vote of a majority of all the members might, perliaps, be well to limit it to ten days elected to such house, and no member shall be after they had signified their readiness to adjourn. twice expelled."
The questiou was put on the amendment of Mr. The Committee on the Powers and Duties of Barker, and it was declared lost. the Legislatore have had this subject under con Mr. KETCHAM -I move to strike out the sideration, and they agree with this amendment. word "two” in the last line, and insert " three" The question was put on the amendment of Mr. in its place. Runisey, aud it was declared adopted.
The question was put on the amendment of Mr. A count was called for,
Ketcham, and it was declared lost.