The CHAIRMAN-The question is on the amendment of Mr. Ketcham to the amendment proposed by Mr. S Townsend. Mr. FOLGER-I suppose that question ia susceptible of a division. I ask that the question be taken on the first proposition, the extension of the term of office to four years. true faith in the capacity of the people for self- with the office of the Chief Executive and holding government. Passing from these more general him to a faithful administration of a large sysobservations, I will proceed to the question before tem. And acting upon that idea-investing the the Convention. Let me say, before adverting to Governor with these powers, loading the office it, that I hope, in the inain, we shall not reject the with these larger responsibilities, I would, as I work of this committee because it is approved by said before, save him from a suspicion that may the committee. for that seems to be the prin- attach to the actual administration of the office. ciple upon which the Convention has thus far Then I am in favor of a longer term, because I proceeded. The fact that the committee were think when a public man separates himself either unanimous, the fact that it was a strong commit- from the pursuits of private life or from other retee, the fact that they had exercised great lations, it should be for a considerable term. I am thought on the subject on which they had re- geuerally in favor of a considerable term of office ported, seems to have been regarded as a reason in all high offices. I would especially make the why the bulk of their work should be rejected. office of the Executive stronger-give greater I hope the bulk of this report is not to be dealt dignity to it, and so secure to the people the with, as others have been, upon that principle. fruits of a larger experience. I would give the I listened with great interest to the distinguished Executive a more permanent status. I am in and venerable Chairman [Mr. C. L. Allen], who favor, therefore, of the largest term proposed by addressed us this morning. I am prepared to accept this amendment - the term of four years, and the what his committee have given us with thankful- principle of ineligibility connected with it. If you ness for the labor they have bestowed upon their cut it down to three years, I am not in favor of work, and yet I am in favor of a slight modifica- ineligibility; but if you come down to two years, tion of this very first section which falls under then I am absolutely against any limitation upon our criticism. I am a little puzzled to know how eligibility. I shall vote on this subject, because the different! propositions are so related that a modification of one involves a modification of all the rest. Now, given a Governor with a short term of office, and no considerable executive patronage, and I am against rendering him ineligible to re-election for the next term. But given a long term to begin with, and considerable execu- The question was then put on the first division, tive patronage, then I am for rendering him in-and it was deciared lost by the following voteeligible for the next term; not on the ground that ayes 27, noes 50. the Governor must become corrupt under such a system, but on the ground that it would preserve this very faith, of which I have spoken, in the Governor, and in the working of the system; for I would have the Governor not only pure, but, like Cæsar's wife, "beyond suspicion," by placing Mr. M. I. TOWNSEND-It is exceedingly grathim in office for a long term and strengthening ifying to my ears to find that some persons for the Executive by a large patronage, with no whom I have a most profound respect upon this temptation to bestow that patronage except in the floor have, either by a change of weather or some interest of the people. I would have him so other circumstances, come to take a happier view placed that the people would not believe that he of the state of the world the prospects of was influenced in the bestowal of patronage, and, official character and conduct in coming times. I in the exercise of his power, by personal consid- have really felt depressed during the last week at erations, by a mere private ambition. Therefore. the melancholy look that has overcast the faces of if we are to invest the Governor with competent a great many whom I have been accustomed to executive patronage, I agree entirely with the see cheerful and buoyant, at the idea of the awful distinguished member from Westchester [Mr. state of things that exist in the country. PerGreeley] in the principle of rendering him ineligi-haps I should not have risen now had it not ble to re-election. If, on the other hand, we con- been to express my exceeding gratification at stitute the office for a term of two years, with the the change that has come over them. I am exceedingly limited patronage of the Executive opposed to rendering the Executive of this State under the present Constitution, then there would ineligible, and for the simpleat reason in the world. seem to be no reason for that restriction in regard I believe that the prospect and hope of re-electo a future election, because there would be notion is the best means of securing good conduct grounds for the suspicion from which I wish to preserve the character of the administration of the Executive for the time being. But I would have a longer term; I would have larger patronage. 1 understand that it is a prevailing opinion in the Convention that the office of the Executive is to be made more respectable by a larger patronage and a larger responsibility; that the things which have to be done of an executive character, and which are now done without responsibility, shall be done under responsibility by connecting them The question was then announced on the second part of the amendment of Mr. Ketcham, declaring that the Governor shall not be eligible for re-election for the term succeeding his incumbency. in office. I do not believe it is a small consideraion to offer to an incurabent in oflice, whether in elevated or moderate condition, to say, "if you conduct yourself worthily of a re-election you shall receive the approbation of those who placed you in an official position." I know of no office where the offer of such a boon, in my opinion, would not be likely to secure a better course of conduct in the discharge of duties, in that office. Now, I will say to the gentleman from Wavne [Mr. Ketcham] that if the wishes of some gen Mr. PAIGE-Gentlemen who have spoken against the eligibility of the Governor for a second term seem to have based their views upon the hypothesis that the appointing power of the Governor will be increased by this Convention. Others have expressed the opinion that if his patrouage remains as it is now, and the two years' term continue, it will be preferable not to adopt the suggestion of ineligibility. It seems to me to be quite hazardous to be voting for this proposisition of ineligibility while the proposition of increasing the patronage of the Governor remains undetermined by the Convention. The term of the Governor of this State was three years from 1777 to 1822; from 1822 to this time it has been two years. I do not think any delegate will say that the Governor, while his term has remained at two years, has ever derived any particular advantages from the appointing power with which he has been invested over other competitors in respect to a re-election. With the present amount of patronage the Governor, certainly, has no superior advantages, if he should desire to use his patronage, over any other competitor for re-election. We have heard no complaint against the tlemen, as they have been expressed on this intructed to or imposed upon him with discharge of door, shall be accomplished by this Convention, duties. With regard to the proposition to extend that there shake a restoration of patronage to the term of the Governor to three years, allow me the Governor, such as has been intimated, there to say one word. I am entirely opposed to making would be no need of the provision, for, with the any change upon this subject, not only from my wielding of such a patronage, no Governor could own convictions of what is right, but because I be re-elected in this State. I will refer to the his- certainly have not heard any desire expressed on tory of the State to show that such is the fact. Take the part of the people of this State that there the three governors who last held office before the should be that change. It is said that we have now change in the Constitution in 1846. It is true extended the term of Senator to four years. True. that the first of those governors-Governor Sew- But I do not believe the people of the State have ard-was re-elected. Gentlemen's memories will called for that change, and I do hope yet to see tell them that the exercise of patronage, which this Convention return to the provisions of the the Governor then possessed, created a great party Constitution upon this subject as they have existed that eventually caused the rejection of Governor since 1846. I believe it is sufficient to make Seward by the people of this State-a party that changes, that it is clearly necessary to make, in followed Mr. Seward with invincible hatred-order to satisfy the public mind, or meet some great until Mr. Seward turned upon his own track and public exigency that may have come upon us. marched in a direction opposite to that which he had pursued up to that time. The next Governor was Governor Bouck. He had the wielding of that patronage. As that patronage was wielded (I do not say it was badly used in the case of Governor Seward), it became impossible for Mr. Bouck to be re-elected. He was followed by that man so eulogized by the gentleman from Washington [Mr. C. L. Allen] to-day, Silas Wright -a man I loved in his lifetime, and shall love as long as God gives me memory. Yet, at the end of two years Silas Wright was doomed to defeat, in consequence of the patronage that he possessed. Take the history of the last twenty years, and it will be found that the Governors we have had, shorn of this patronage, have been enabled so to conduct themselves in office that, at least, they seemed to maintain the confidence of their political friends. Where is the man who dared to breathe a word of hostility against John A. King, when he went out of office? Did not the political friends of Governor Seymour retain their confidence in him when he went out of office? Did not the political friends of Governor Morgan retain their confidence in him when he went out of office? Has not the present Execu-incumbents of the office of Governor that they tive the confidence of his political friends-I had had used their patronage to aid in a re-nominaalmost said of those who are politically arrayed tion or re-election. One gentleman has expressed against him? But if the patronage shall be re- the opinion that this patronage has been injurious stored, there is no need of this proposition of the to the incumbent in respect to a re-election. This gentleman from Wayne, if you desire to prevent question has been carefully and thoughtfully conhis re-election. It is putting into the hands ofsidered by the committee, and, as I have heard no the Governor a power he never should possess, a power that has never been wielded for the best interests of the people of this State, and never will be-not because the Governors will not be honest for I believe our Governors have been selected from the best men in the world, and that there is as much material in the world to-day from which to select Governors as there ever was. I have already expressed myself as not believing that dark days have come upon us, The Governor sits in the center of the State. He is not omniscient. The people in every county know who are fit men for office in their respective counties, better than any Governor can know. The Governor of the State sits in the center, and he acts from the best light he can get. It is for that reason he must of necessity make mistakes, and making those mistakes, he secures his own destruction in the exercise of power that never ought to be sufficient reasons advanced by any gentleman to justify a change of the term of office reported by the committee or the adoption of the principle of ineligibility, I hope the term will remain as reported. I shall vote against a change of the term and against the proposition of ineligibility. The question was then put upon that portion of the amendment of Mr. Ketcham inserting after the word "years" in the second line, language excluding the Governor from eligibility to office for the ensuing term, and it was declared lost. The question recurred on the amendment of SEC. 2. No person except a citizen of the United States shall be eligible to the office of Governor, nor shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained the age of thirty years, and who shall not have been five years next pre-greater. Duties might be devolved upon him, or ceding his election a resident within this State. hospitalities which might induce the Legislature There being no amendments, the SECRETARY to increase his salary, and not dimiuish it. I proceeded to read the third section, as follows: therefore propose that these words should be SEC. 3. The Governor and Lieutenant-Governor stricken out and those that I have stated inserted shall be elected at the times and places of choos-in their place. ing members of the Assembly. The persons Mr. S. TOWNSEND-I have a proviso I wish respectively having the highest number of votes to offer for the consideration of this Convention for Governor and Lieutenant-Governor shall be at a later period of its session, submitting the elected; but in case two or more shall have an question separately to the people whether at a equal and the highest number of votes for Gov- fixed future period all salaries, interest and taxes eruor or for Lieutenant Governor, the two Houses shall be paid in specie. It now lies on the Presiof the Legislature, at its next annual session, dent's table. This is the only mode to obviate shall forthwith, by joint ballot, choose one of the the difficulty suggested by my friend from New said persons so having an equal and the highest York [Mr. Robertson]. A salary paid in a curnumber of votes for Governor or Lieutenant- rency which was worth at one time 35 cents, anGoveruor. other time one hundred, is painfully unjust and There being no amendment, the SECRETARY inconvenient to this class of public employees, proceeded to read the fourth section, as follows: who require a fixed remuneration to requite propSEC. 4. The Governor shall be Commander-in-erly their services. When that comes properly Chief of the military and naval forces of the State. He shall have power to convene the Legislature (or the Senate only) on extraordinary occasions. He shall communicate by message to the Legislature at every session the condition of the State, and recommend such measures to them as he shall judge expedient. He shall transact all necessary business with the officers of govern- SEC. 5. In case of the impeachment of the ment, civil and military He shall expedite all Governor, or his removal from office, death, inasuch measures as may be resolved upon by the bility to discharge the powers and duties of the Legislature, and shall take care that the laws are said office, resignation or absence from the State, faithfully executed. He shall at stated times re- the powers and duties of the office shall devolve ceive for his services a compensation to be estab- upon the Lieutenant-Governor for the residue of lished by law, to be first fixed by the Legislature at the term, or until the disability shall cease. But its first session after the adoption of this Consti- when the Governor shall, with the consent of the tution, and which compensation shall neither be Legislature, be out of the State in time of war, increased nor diminished after his election or dur-at the head of a military force thereof, he shall ing his term of office. before the Convention as a distinct proposition, I hope my friend will support it. The question was then put on the amendmen of Mr. Robertson, and it was declared lost. There being no other amendments the SECRETARY proceeded to read the fifth section as follows: continue commander-in-chief of all the military Lieutenant-Governor shall be impeached, displaced, resign, die, or become incapable of performing the duties of his office, or he be absent from the State, the President of the Senate shall act as Governor, until the vacancy be filled, or the disability shall cease. Mr. ROBERTSON-I have an amendment to sug-force of the State. gest to the 14th line. Strike out the words "nei- There being no amendments the SECRETARY ther be increased nor" and insert in lieu thereof proceeded to read the sixth section as follows: the words "not be." I do not see any good SEC. 6. The Lieutenant-Governor shall possess reason why the power of the Legislature to the same qualifications of eligibility for office as increase the salary of the Governor should the Governor. He shall be President of the not remain with them. I can ot understand Senate, but shall have only a casting vote therein. why it should be considered as a mere coutract If, during a vacancy of the office of Governor, the between the Legislature and the Governor that he should perform the duties of Governor during his continuance in office for a stated compensa tion. Circumstances may arise, and heretofore have arisen in this State and the United States, by which the rate of compensation fixed at the time of the Governor entering upon the duties of There being no amendments the SECRETARY his office has varied during his continuance in proceeded to read the seventh section as follows: office. I can see no reason for the dread which SEC. 7. The Lieutenant-Governor shall receive our fathers had on the other side of the water of for his services a compensation to be established the danger of combination between the Executive by law, to be first fixed by the Legislature at its and the Legislature to bring up influence enough first session after the adoption of this Constitu to pass improper laws. I have no such appre- tion, and which compensation shall neither be hension in regard to the Governor if elected increased nor diminished after his election or by the people of this State. I see no reason during his term of office, and he shall not receive why the Legislature (although by a threat of diminishing the salary the Governor might be forced to give his signature to measures he might not perhaps otherwise approve) should not be intrusted with authority to enlarge his compensa- There being no amendments, the SECRETARY tion during his continuance in office. A great proceeded to read the eighth section as follows. change might arise in the price of living during SEC. 8. Every bill which shall have passed the his continuance in office, making his expenses Senate or Assembly shall, before it becomes a or be entitled to any other or further compensation, fees or perquisites for any other duties or services he may be required to perform by virtue of his office by this Constitution or by law. Mr. C L. ALLEN-I do not know that there is any objection. It is pretty near the time of adjournment. The CHAIRMAN. That can only be reached by a motion to rise and report progress. Mr. C. L. ALLEN-I will adopt that suggestion if the committee think proper. Mr. BURRILL- Then I move that this committee do now rise, report progress, and ask leave to sit again. The question was put on the motion of Mr. Burrill, and it was declared carried. Whereupon the committee rose, and the President resumed the chair in Convention. law, be presented to the Governor. If he approve of the bill he shall sign it. But if he disapprove of it, or of any part of it, containing separate and distinct provisions, he shall return it to that House in which the bill shall have originated, with his objections to the whole or such part or parts of it as he shall disapprove, which shall enter the objections at large in their journal and proceed to reconsider it. If, after such reconsideration, either of an entire bill or of a part or parts of said bill objected to, as the case may be, two-thirds of all the members elected to that House shall agree to pass the whole bill, it shall be sent, together with the objections, to the other House, by which it shall Mr. KERNAN, from the Committee of the be reconsidered, and if approved by two-thirds Whole, reported that the committee had had of all the members elected to that House it shall under consideration the report of the Committee become a law, notwithstanding the objections of on the Governor, and Lieutenant-Governor, their the Governor. If either of the two Houses shall election, tenure of office, etc., had made some not thus approve of the part or parts objected to, progress therein; but not having gone through the bill containing such part or parts as shall be therewith, had requested their Chairman to reapproved by the Governor shall, without un-port that fact to the Convention, and ask leave necessary delay after the vote is taken on such to sit again. reconsideration, be engrossed as a separate bill and returned to the Governor for his signature. But in all such cases the votes of both Houses shall be determined by yeas and nays, and the names of the members voting for and against the bill shall be entered on the journal of each House respectively. If any bill shall not be returned by the Governer within ten days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the same shall be a law in like manner as if he had signed it, unless the Legislature shall by their adjournment prevent its return, in which case it shall not be a law. The right of the Governor to sign bills shall cease with the adjournment of the Legislature. Mr. BURRILL-Mr. ChairmanMr. C. L. ALLEN-I desire to say one word on the subject of this eighth section, which I omitted to state in making my remarks at the beginning of this debate. It is well known that bills accumulate on the Governor at the close of each session of the Legislature. The present incumbent, informed me a few days since that there were about four hundred and eighty bills on his tile at the close of the session of the last Legislature. Now, it was impossible for him, to use his own words, physically or mentally, to read one-quarter of these bills and give them a timely consideration prior to giving his signature. If, therefore, time was to be allotted for the signing of bills after the adjournment of the Legislature, he suggested that the time be shortened and that he should not have the whole recess, as under the present Constitution, but that the time should be limited to thirty days after the close of the session of the Legislature to sign bills, if it should be determined to give any time for that purpose at all— Mr. BURRILL-If the gentleman will permit me, I would like to make a suggestion. With his consent I would like to make a motion to ask that the consideration of this section be suspended until the coming in of the report of the Committes on the Powers and Duties of the Legislature, which committee has had this subject under consideration. The question was put on granting leave, and it was declared carried. Mr. BURRILL-I move that the committee be discharged from the consideration of the eighth section of this report until the coming in of the report of the Committee on the Powers and Duties of the Legislature. The PRESIDENT The Chair would inform the gentleman that his motion is not admissible. Mr. SEAVER-I ask leave of absence for Mr. Merritt. There being no objection, leave was granted. Mr. MORRIS-I move that the Convention do now adjourn. The question was then put on the motion of MONDAY, August 12, 1867. The Convention met at half-past seven o'clock. P. M. Prayer was offered by Rev. AMBROSE O'NEILL The Journal of Friday was read by the SECRETARY, and approved. Mr. BELL presented the petition of Jesse Babcock and forty others, citizens of Brownville, Jefferson county, praying for a povision in the Constitution securing to the people of this State the right to catch fish in the international waters of this State Which was referred to the Committee on the Preamble and Bill of Rights. Mr. BARTO presented the petition of M. S. Cuykendall, Hoyt Parcell and others, citizens of Owasco, praying for the incorporation of a clause in the Constitution abolishing the office of school commissioner and restoring the former system of town supervision. Which was referred to the Committee on Edu cation. Mr. DUGANNE presented six several petitions from citizens of New York asking for a provision in the Constitution prohibiting the donation of public moueys to sectarian institutions. considered the proceedings that ought to take place in case a bill is vetoed by the Governor. Which was referred to the Committee on the That is the principal subject-matter of this eighth Powers and Duties of the Legislature. section; and the committee, of which I am a Mr. GRAVES presented the petition of Am-member, are very anxious it should not be conbrose Hill and fifty-six others, citizens of Oneida county, asking that a clause be incorporated in the Constitution prohibiting the sale of intoxicating liquors. sidered until it be considered in connection with our report, which will be ready soon. Mr. WAKEMAN-If I understand the resolution aright, it proposes to discharge the Committee Which was referred to the Committee on of the Whole fro:n the Consideration of that Adulterated Liquors. section. Am I right? The PRESIDENT presented a communication from Hou. Thomas Hillhouse, Comptroller, in answer to a resolution of the Convention adopted on the 8th instant. Which was referred to the Committee on the Finances of the State. The PRESIDENT-It is pointed toward a certain section. Mr. WAKEMAN-The eighth section, which I deem the most important section of the entire article. If the operation of taking it from the Committee of the Whole will cut off debate, it The PRESIDENT also presented a communica-scens to me the resolution ought not to be tion from Thomas C. Acton, prosideut of the board of commissioners of Metropolitan police, in answer to a resolution of the Convention adopted on the 2d instant. Which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary. adopted. That section of the report received a good deal of consideration at the hands of the committee, and we deem it the most importan change made in the whole article. If the Com mittee of the Whole is to be discharged from the consideration of that section, and the matter referred to another committee, I hope it will be voted down. I believe that section ought to be Mr. BELL-I hold in my hand a letter from Mr. Prosser, of Erie, a member of this Convention, who states that he will be unavoidably ab-considered in Committee of the Whole by itself. sent for two days, and desires me to ask leave of absence for him for that time. There being no objection leave was granted. Mr. HITCHCOCK-I am this evening in receipt of a telegram from my colleague, Mr. C. L. Allen, of Washington, stating that he is seriously ill, and requesting me to ask leave of absence for him. As I believe him to be seriously ill, it is necessary, I think, that his leave of absence should be indefinite. There being no objection leave was granted. Mr. S. TOWNSEND offered the following resolution : Resolved, That the Committee on the Preamble and Bill of Rights, be requested to take under consideration the propriety of recognizing in the Constitution the principle of continuing a certain portion of the compensation to such designated officers in the civil service of the State, who, after a term of faithful and her.orable service, have retired from public duty. If it shall be deferred altogether for the present, I shall not object to it; but in the absence of the chairman of the committee [Mr. C. L. Allen], who I understand is sick, hope this resolution will not be adopted. Mr. HITCHCOCK -I merely desire to say to gentlemen that the chairman of the committee [Mr. C. L. Allen] was very anxious that the conSideration of the article should be postponed until his return, if practicable. Mr. RUMSEY-The only effect of sending it to the Committee on the Powers and Duties of the Legislature will be to have them report upon this section; then it will come back to the Convention, and go again to the Committee of the Whole on the report of the two committees, where it will be discussed. That I understand to be the effect of it, and nothing more. Mr. A. J. PARKER-I hope that last section will not be sent to another standing committee. It seems to me quite unnecessary. I am willing Which was referred to the Committee on the it should be postponed in consequence of the Preamble and Bill of Rights. illness of the chairman of the committee C. L. Allen], who reported that section. It would be very well, perhaps, Resolved, That the Committee of the Whole be to postpone the consideration of it, as I discharged from the further consideration of the suppose he will probably be here in a few days eighth section of report of the standing Commit-again; it might be postponed, perhaps, until the tee on the Governor and Lieutenant-Governor.other committee the Committee on the Powers their election, etc., and that the same be referred nd Duties of the Legislature—shall make a to the standing Committee No. 3, on the Powers report; but it seems to ine improper to send it to and duties of the Legislature, etc. other standing committee. It ought to remain n Committee of the Whole to be considered at such time as shall suit the Convention. Mr. E. A. BROWN offered the rollowing reso-[Mr. lution: Mr. E. A. BROWN-A single word. It will be remembered Mr. ALVORD-If it gives rise to debate, the resolution must lie over under the rule. The PRESIDENT-The resolution relating to the order of business, the Chair rules it may now be considered. Mr. E. A. BROWN-I simply desire to remark. Mr. President, that the Committee on the Powers and Duties of the Legislature have very carefully Mr. ALVORD-It seems to me to be rather inlelicate, to say the least of it, to take a matter, which evidently is within the province of the standing committee of this Convention, which is ready to be acted upon in Committee of the Whole, away from that committee and send it to mother committee. It would look upon its face as if the Convention had not sufficient confidence |